Would you continue using OMLx if there were no forum or chat rooms?

“I see that we still don’t understand each other! Neither I nor Italians, in general, think that philosophy is a waste of time. Far from it.”

That seems to be a problem with your self awareness, not whether we understand each other. This is an empty gesture to post in your native language and have others do the work you should be doing to help them understand your position. It’s lazy, and that is putting it kindly. I am doing exactly what you could be doing and there doesn’t seem to be any significant barriers to understanding the translated text.

“I meant that pragmatically, the substance lies in the first part of the answer, in the rest of the speech we are talking about ideals and abstract concepts that are sometimes difficult to put into practice without a correct synthesis.”

It took more work on your part to speak theory that you are admitting you cannot provide a consistent result for, than it would have been to just admit you were trying to be dishonest and acted in bad faith. The issue at hand is your use of the description that this topic is a “waste of time.” That is a subjective opinion based on what you think the subject of this topic is, or should be. The purpose of it is to get an idea about exactly what you are complaining about, and what everyone else is saying.

The community is made up of people with real diversity in background and thought. We also need to see where time is best used and wasted as it pertains to the goals of the project. That is only going to come from asking people in a centralized location. Good, and bad ideas must be proven in such a way. Through discussion and debate.

“There is a saying that sums this up and it is “we are frying the air” said in a joking way. I hope your translator correctly reports what I mean.”

Again, that is lazy and an unreasonable expectation that you cannot articulate what you mean in your language let alone that it be translated accurately into another. It proves my point that things said in one culture may be deemed offensive in other cultures when translated. I don’t think interactions like that should be censored. There should be a common goal to be understood and debate things without needing to meet every single person’s expectation of comfort.

I think that, “we are frying the air,” contextually means we are just “talking with heated words and not getting anywhere”. That assumes I am using heated words. I’m not. I’m using words and concepts which you do not agree with. Therefore, I am not taking any responsibility for starting any such heated argument. I do not control other people’s emotions and responses. That would make other people my slaves, and I do not condone any such relationship.

Co tu się stało, włosi kłócą się z anglosasami o filozofię używając translatorów
Ja pierdole ale cyrk

Autotranslation

What’s going on here? Italians are arguing with Anglo-Saxons about philosophy in Italian using translators. I’m f***ing kidding, but what a circus

Actual Translation
“What on earth is happening? Italians are arguing with English speakers about philosophy using translators. What a shitshow.”

PS What a clusterfuck. is a better equivalent of polish Ja pierdole
PS 2 my english is real bad I don’t have courage to discuss complex ideas in that language especially philosophy. Using a translator is even worse idea in this situation.

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What on earth is happening?

Se passa il concetto che in OffTopic ognuno fa un po’ cosa vuole (?) allora vale anche che ciascuno scrive nella sua propria lingua.

Per inciso, una discussione tra un nativo Anglo-Sassone e altri che non lo sono è oltremodo scorretto (very much unfair, so that you get exactly what I mean). E anche irrispettoso (disrespectful) verso chi non lo è.

I nativi madrelingua Inglese -non tutti ovviamente- non lo capiscono, o peggio non gli importa. Mi verrebbe da dire se ne approfittano, e ci giocano - ma non lo dico..
Facessero anche loro la fatica di usare un traduttore, come facciamo noi quotidianamente, e poi vediamo come va a finire..

Un bell’esempio calzante:

I think that, “we are frying the air,” contextually means we are just “talking with heated words and not getting anywhere”. That assumes I am using heated words. I’m not.

Non è così. ‘Aria fritta’ vuol dire semplicemente ‘Inutile’ e/o ‘Dispendioso di energie inutilmente’.

Prexactly [cit. @WilsonPhillips] :+1:

PS>
This way you find yourself excluded from participating in discussions.
Rinse and repeat.

PS2>

fwiw..

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That needs to go both ways. This rant started with someone lying about translating their words into English. There doesn’t seem to be a conversation in Italian where “philosophy” could be confused with “waste of time.” Like it or not, both are derived from Latin and should not be that contextually different.

Mi hai chiesto tu di scrivere in italiano…. (You asked me to write in Italian…)

Poi mi racconti in che film hai visto queste cose! (Then tell me in which movie you saw these things!)

Comunque ancora non mi era capitato di essere accusato di essere disonesto ed in mala fede, questo lo trovo molto offensivo.

(However, I have not yet been accused of being dishonest and in bad faith, and I find this very offensive.)

Inoltre, mi accusi di mentire perchè cerco di spiegarti in inglese quello che volgio dire:

(Furthermore, you accuse me of lying because I try to explain to you in English what I mean:)

Non so in inglese ma in italiano anche dare del bugiardo è unoffesa e non mi sogno di dirlo a nessuno.

(I don’t know about English, but in Italian even calling someone a liar is an insult, and I wouldn’t dream of telling anyone.)

Tutto dopo che hai messo su una discussione perchè il resto del mondo non interpreta, secondo te, correttamente una frase e la sua applicazione

(All after you’ve started an argument because the rest of the world doesn’t interpret, in your opinion, a sentence and its application correctly.)

Visto che solo tu capisci bene, interpreti e sai, per quello che mi riguarda non ho altro da aggiungere.

(Since only you understand, interpret, and know well, as far as I’m concerned, I have nothing else to add.)

Hai proprio ragione tu, sei riuscito a farmi cambiare idea, ora credo di aver perso solo tempo oltre ad aver ricevuto offese gratuite, potrei ricambiare il favore ma non è nel mio stile mi spiace.

(You’re absolutely right, you managed to change my mind, now I think I’ve just wasted my time and received gratuitous insults, I could return the favor but that’s not my style, I’m sorry.)

Personalmente credo che il forum sia utile e fondamentale per la comunità, credo anche che il regolamento Tos e Faq sia sbagliato solo per chi vuole trovare qualcosa di marcio in esso, la prova di questo è che questa discussione esiste e nessuno, io per primo, pensa che non debba essere così.

(Personally, I believe the forum is useful and fundamental for the community. I also believe the TOS and FAQ rules are only bad for those who want to find something rotten in them. The proof of this is that this discussion exists and no one, myself included, thinks it shouldn’t be this way.)

Tante cose!
(So many things!)

@rugyada No mate I only want to emphasize that there are topicks difficoult for me to talk about in foregin language. Im more then capable of disscuss tech stuff in english. English is an IT / Tech latin of the world.

Do I make mistakes? Im more than certain of it. Yet as long as I stick to “IT” Im understandable for others.

Have you ever seen a surgeon used Lain in a context other than his proffesion I do not think so. Same goes with english for me. I have no use for this language outside this forum. You need completely different wocabulary to discuss diffrent topics: such as philosophy, medicine, transportation, botany or whatever. Im aware Im lack of some portion of vocabulary to discuss some topics in a propper manner online thats all. In a live conversation it is sometimes easyer to talk about vider range of topics for various reasons.

Saying all that

I do not think so It started like that. @rugyada is right with that the English speakers assume english is an default language! It is not.

There is around 380 million native english speakers around the globe.

We have about 345 million to over 580 million people worldwide speak Hindi

There is approximately 300 to over 420 million people speak Arabic as their native language.

1.3 to 1.39 billion people speak a variety of Chinese as their native language (first language) so nope. So if anything is default then chinese is.

You are not default. Havent heard a chines guy accusing anybody of lying that one use chinese to watever translator.

Yet he have every right because chinese is in a fact most probably default language on earth

We do not lie about using translators. We use them because we have no use for english outside internet for the most part. Language skill as any other skill weakens when not use, so those tools are usefull yet should be used with caucion.

PS this text is most certain full of mistakes and lingustic abominations
Wast majority of us are not exactly fluent in english yet we can use more then one language to comunicate

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I did no such thing:

See previous response.

I accuse you of lying because you said that we are wasting time and then you explain away the opinion by saying that the translator that you used did not translate it properly which prompted this response:

The only way you ever feel the need to twist those things around and then treat the readers like they are too gullible to scroll up and see what you posted, is if you intended to be dishonest.

Why would you be indignant towards me for calling out a lie that you told? No one really believes you are sorry for that. I don’t know who you are appealing to, but you are not succeeding at it.

There are people that think discussions like this should not happen in this community. That’s the point. The same ToS and FAQ that you covet, needs to be applied fairly. When they are not compatible, that is impossible. You can sit there and say, “You only find something bad in there because you want to,” but that is horribly naive. If you are not willing to look further into something like that and just take information you are given about a given topic, then you are susceptible to being manipulated. If people are here to help the community and project be strong, then agreement about everything will never get us there. It is by being challenged (sometimes about how horrible it is to imply people are too weak, stupid, or fragile to stand up for themselves) that creates the correct kind of diversity (of thought and ability). Otherwise, words like “hate speech” will be used as a cudgel and later as a basic term for, “I don’t like that this person called me a liar.” The error, is thinking that a change like that needs to be immediate to be horrible.

I was pointing out that “philosophy” and “waste of time” do not mean the same thing in any language. So, how a translator came up with that in any language is next to impossible. Especially between two languages derived from Latin.

Did the person making the statement think philosophy is a waste of time? Probably. If that had been said, the conversation would have gone a different, and possibly more productive way. I can tell you, that probably would have been the end of it if the truth had been said from the beginning. Now that I know what I am dealing with, I’m not inclined to engage in discussions with that person any further.

Sure, same here. Actually I fully agree with you.

That’s yet another evidence if any need that while talking about something which does not pertain to plain IT/Tech, which I can live with, foreign languages may be a barrier for understanding each other.

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@zeroability English is not a romanic language it is in a germanic group. Does it have romanic let say “conotations” for the lack of better term surely. BTH there you got me at “conotations” its most definitely not a correct term in that context. But my wocabulary is far from perfect and rather small. Ok lets go back to the subiect. Translating directly from romanic to germanic language, while using some sort of AI can be a shitshow. Im a user of Polish a slavic language in (West Slavic subgroup).

Translating anything more complex then simple sentences from Polish to English by AI is a shit show in a dupster fire. To put it mildly Polish is fucking wierd language with a metric ton of wierd rules and phraseology. I always triple check what im writing in english yet stil I got lot of things wrong because Im a) thinking in polish b) even If I thinking english I use polish for sentences construction. Im incapeble to swich to propper English way no mather what

My point is **There is no bad will here from anybody I preasume.
**
Shitty situation will happend when two who use natively complitly diffrent languages try to talk in languge they both consider as second or one of them consider as second and is not fluent

Take care @zeroability and have a great day

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This is also my default position when it comes to having a conversation with anyone. Whether I agree with them, or not. The problem is when there cannot be honest, genuine conversation. By that, I mean I cannot be my genuine self, but the other party decides they must at all times be their genuine selves. I give people plenty of time to acknowledge that this must be the case, along with developing an honest dialog. It falls apart when that does not happen, and it is very easy to tell when it does not happen.

Greetings, I am interested in the focus of this topic and wanted to share a thought. I think OpenMandriva is an interesting project, not only from a technical point of view but above all for its philosophy, which is its main driving force. I think of the origins of OM, which started from two different worlds, one with the Cyrillic alphabet ROSA and the other with the Latin alphabet MANDRIVA, and gave rise to a new distribution. This was possible because those who participated in its creation had a common goal. The differences in language, expression, mindset, thought processes and other aspects were difficult to overcome. However, if we understand that differences exist, we can reach our goal.

Groups of different foreigners, languages and cultures working together normally have misunderstandings. These misunderstandings are due to a variety of factors. Even when one side tries to ask the other for further explanations, it is not possible to reach a positive conclusion. Things that have no meaning for one person are offensive to others. It is not easy in a world of diversity.

The ways to eliminate misunderstandings are mutual respect and sharing; trying to understand that there can be enormous differences even in small expressions or concepts, sharing a common project and trying to find one or more possible and achievable solutions.

I hope that OpenMandriva continues to thrive, and above all, that it can grow its community and maintain its principles. I am certain that with the expertise, technology, experience, ideas and resources available, the best solution will be found to support knowledge and technical assistance, and sometimes even “moral support”.

I have used traslator, I hope it went well. Good luck to everyone!

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That is one of many reasons I do not use Void linux and I pobably never will. They do not have forum, they only have redit. … A crazy platform where any info is hard to find, they ban you for wrong thinking and using words they do not like. Yet… they have no problem with redits like Gone wild (put here anything). With all sorts of OF “models“ and chicks looks almost or most probably are underage. Literally no one bans that. That’s not a problem, yet write something like Im proud to be (put nationality) or Im proud to be christian. Bam You ban for life.

But if one identifies one self as: a self-propelled bathtub with dual faucets drive. Then horray you are so brave and valid.

To make long story short, if a distro has only Facebook redit discord or any sort of social media but lacks of forum I do not use it

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I just hit a year on OMLx about a week or so ago, and I think I’ve made 4 comments here.

My OS works. What else do I need? I do pop in here every couple weeks just to see if there’s anything big happening, and I’ve never used the chat room, but those are not factors in my choice to continue to use OM or not. I’m capable of reading and troubleshooting, so unless I have a MAJOR issue I’m happy with OM.

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I just hit a year as well.

I’ve got everything working flawlessly. I’ve made a couple of package requests in the past year. Both were fulfilled quickly, and I’m very thankful for that.

I like to come to the forum and see what others are posting about. I often find the information useful. Would I still use OMLx if there wasn’t a forum? Most likely. I know the maintainers have my back when it comes to the philosophical approach of the distro. Still, I’d miss the forum if it went away.

All for now, and out.

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